E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Sun May 15, 2022 8:00 pm

hashluck wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 12:35 pm
Pretty normal behaviour for E46 B3 cold start up? Just let it do its thing for 20-30 seconds. Warms up quickly
Thank you for this , starting to think this may be just something to live with

Yeah cold start up only , fine after warmed up. Jumpy revs and choking sound like the engine will cut out. Anywhere between 17-21 seconds usually , after this smooth as you like. I’m just going to try and enjoy the thing for this summer and not stress about it anymore.

Any recommendations on tyres for this beast ? Been going through old posts and Michelin Pilot Sports seem to be the go to

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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Sun May 15, 2022 8:02 pm

simon13 wrote:
Sat May 14, 2022 11:06 pm
theres only 1 air pump i think. Its only activates from cold and pumps air into the Cats until they are warm
I’m confident we are on about the same thing , it does vibrate pretty horrible on a cold start and shuts off when the revs smooth out. So I think you’re onto something. Any ideas where I could get this pump for the future ? Is it Alpina specific ?
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by simon13 » Sun May 15, 2022 8:24 pm

no the pump is not Alpina specific. I believe Charles replaced his as it got really bad. Its shared with renault clios of some sort so he found out! you can also remove it and have it coded out if you wished

I just let mine run for a bit from cold then move off, because as you say i'm not keen on kangerooing up the road. Mine is worse as its manual transmission now
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by Charles » Sun May 15, 2022 9:31 pm

simon13 wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 8:24 pm
no the pump is not Alpina specific. I believe Charles replaced his as it got really bad. Its shared with renault clios of some sort so he found out! you can also remove it and have it coded out if you wished
We are talking about two different pumps here.

The cold start auxiliary air pump is located to the left of the engine just back from the screen wash tank (for the B3S at least). It has a circular top and is very obvious in the engine bay. I have replaced this in the past with a used part from a BMW breaker as it is a standard BMW item. This item pumps extra air into the exhaust manifold at cold start to improve emissions and runs for about 30-40 seconds. You can clearly hear it running.

The pump that is also used in Renault, Peugeot, Citroen and Volvo is the auxiliary vacuum pump which is located under the inlet manifold on the right hand side of the engine. It provides extra vacuum to assist the brakes until the main system builds up adequate vacuum. When this fails, the brake pedal is hard for about 30 seconds from cold start. This part is NLA anywhere but, so long as you understand its impact and allow the vacuum to build up before rushing off, then you wouldn't notice it.
I just let mine run for a bit from cold then move off, because as you say i'm not keen on kangerooing up the road.
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by Charles » Sun May 15, 2022 9:39 pm

I also had a thought about the steering wheel judder. The E46 is very sensitive to bush wear and if you are getting judder - particularly when braking - then one of the front suspension bushes is wearing. It is probably the rear wishbone bush - known as the lollipop or brake reaction bush.

The standard E46 items wear regularly so you might consider swapping these out for polyurethane ones, but this hardens up the ride. Alternatively, a neat upgrade is to use E85 Z4M lollipops which are slightly offset from centre. They sharpen up the handling without hardening the ride BUT you will need to realign the front end because the offset throws out the alignment.
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Tue May 17, 2022 2:08 am

Charles wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 9:39 pm
I also had a thought about the steering wheel judder. The E46 is very sensitive to bush wear and if you are getting judder - particularly when braking - then one of the front suspension bushes is wearing. It is probably the rear wishbone bush - known as the lollipop or brake reaction bush.
Apologies for not mentioning in my update. It turns out the front shock absorbers were so shot that was what was causing the judder. It drives gorgeously now. Just thinking about some new rubbers as they’re currently all mismatched tyres. Will definitely look at upgrading the bushes soon anyway as I don’t know their history and doubt have been changed for years.
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Tue May 17, 2022 2:11 am

simon13 wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 8:24 pm
no the pump is not Alpina specific. I believe Charles replaced his as it got really bad. Its shared with renault clios of some sort so he found out! you can also remove it and have it coded out if you wished

I just let mine run for a bit from cold then move off, because as you say i'm not keen on kangerooing up the road. Mine is worse as its manual transmission now
I believe the pump I’m referring to is the huge one to the left of the engine, like Charles has stated. This is what is vibrating on a cold start and generally just noisy.


Can this be temporarily disconnected to see if this is in fact causing my rough cold starts ?
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by Charles » Tue May 17, 2022 8:33 am

E46330 wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 2:11 am
I believe the pump I’m referring to is the huge one to the left of the engine, like Charles has stated. This is what is vibrating on a cold start and generally just noisy.

Can this be temporarily disconnected to see if this is in fact causing my rough cold starts ?
It sounds like the air pump is on its way out, I'm afraid, as these sound like very similar symptoms to when mine failed.

Might sound strange, but see what happens when you start from cold by pushing gently down on the top of the pump. Over time, the mounts for the pump give way and by pushing down on the top, it can re-engage and do what it should be doing. If this works then you can see/hear what it should sound like when working properly - although, if it needs pushing down to work, then it has failed anyway and will need replacing.

As for disconnecting it, there should be an electrical connection into the pump which can be disconnected. I'm not in front of my car right now so cannot tell you exactly where it is.

A quick search reveals that replacements can be found for less than £50 and it should be an easy swap out task
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by Henry » Fri May 20, 2022 10:59 pm

Had some problems with the aux air pump some time ago and renewed the vacuum pipes to it. Check the solenoid valve is fully opening and more importantly that it fully closes and doesn’t allow exhaust gases to pass into the pump when it switches off. Also the top round cover on the pump unclips and there is a filter in there, mine had completely disintegrated after 20 odd years so I hoovered it out and cut a piece of course sponge to shape to fit. The cold start works fine now so one of those things worked. Didn’t have the patience to try them separately
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:11 pm

Charles wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 8:33 am
E46330 wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 2:11 am
I believe the pump I’m referring to is the huge one to the left of the engine, like Charles has stated. This is what is vibrating on a cold start and generally just noisy.

Can this be temporarily disconnected to see if this is in fact causing my rough cold starts ?
It sounds like the air pump is on its way out, I'm afraid, as these sound like very similar symptoms to when mine failed.

Might sound strange, but see what happens when you start from cold by pushing gently down on the top of the pump. Over time, the mounts for the pump give way and by pushing down on the top, it can re-engage and do what it should be doing. If this works then you can see/hear what it should sound like when working properly - although, if it needs pushing down to work, then it has failed anyway and will need replacing.

As for disconnecting it, there should be an electrical connection into the pump which can be disconnected. I'm not in front of my car right now so cannot tell you exactly where it is.

A quick search reveals that replacements can be found for less than £50 and it should be an easy swap out task
Tried holding down the pump on a cold start and it does make it a little bit better but it’s barely noticeable. This may seem strange but where I park my car overnight I have two spaces , one is on a slope which when parked with the car backwards so the engine is facing uphill , and I start my car in the morning it is absolutely fine , doesn’t miss a beat. The other space is completely flat and when parked here it does jump around on the revs and chokes up for 20 seconds or so.

I’ve found the connection for the pump will try and disconnect it this weekend and report back to see if it makes a difference. When looking for the pump online I have been unable to find it as cheap as you stated. I think I’ve found OEM BMW part and is about £150 which isn’t too bad.
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:21 pm

Henry wrote:
Fri May 20, 2022 10:59 pm
Had some problems with the aux air pump some time ago and renewed the vacuum pipes to it. Check the solenoid valve is fully opening and more importantly that it fully closes and doesn’t allow exhaust gases to pass into the pump when it switches off. Also the top round cover on the pump unclips and there is a filter in there, mine had completely disintegrated after 20 odd years so I hoovered it out and cut a piece of course sponge to shape to fit. The cold start works fine now so one of those things worked. Didn’t have the patience to try them separately
When I am playing around with it this weekend I will pop open the cover and check out that filter. I’m thinking going with Charles’ and your advice and replacing the pump part and the pipes that run to it for peace of mind , it’s consistent and not getting worse at this stage so not very concerning more of an annoyance. I know some people would live with it but I’m a little meticulous with my car and would like it running 100%


A little bit unrelated to the current topic , but pertinent to the original post , I’ve had the car and ran about 600 miles on the rebuilt transmission and today for the first time I decided to test out the kick-down , and unfortunately it put the car into limp mode as the revs go really high but no power delivery comes from this. It’s hard to explain exactly what happened but I was on the motorway doing about 50mph and kicked down the accelerator all the way to the floor , the revs raced through to about 7k and then it suddenly drops off a cliff to about 3.5k/4k and all power goes , keeping the foot down once the rpm dips sends the car into limp mode , EML , traction control and check engine light illuminates on the dashboard and the car starts to lurch forward even with the foot off the gas and and cannot go more than 60mph.

Mackie Transmissions gave me a 3 year warranty or 100k miles whichever comes first so I’ll give them a call on Monday and see if they’ve got any slots coming up , I think it needs seeing to again
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by Charles » Sat Jun 04, 2022 10:31 am

E46330 wrote:
Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:11 pm
When looking for the pump online I have been unable to find it as cheap as you stated. I think I’ve found OEM BMW part and is about £150 which isn’t too bad.
My price was from a breaker but £150 for a new one isn't bad.
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by DogWagen » Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:12 am

E46330 wrote:
Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:21 pm

A little bit unrelated to the current topic , but pertinent to the original post , I’ve had the car and ran about 600 miles on the rebuilt transmission and today for the first time I decided to test out the kick-down , and unfortunately it put the car into limp mode as the revs go really high but no power delivery comes from this. It’s hard to explain exactly what happened but I was on the motorway doing about 50mph and kicked down the accelerator all the way to the floor , the revs raced through to about 7k and then it suddenly drops off a cliff to about 3.5k/4k and all power goes , keeping the foot down once the rpm dips sends the car into limp mode , EML , traction control and check engine light illuminates on the dashboard and the car starts to lurch forward even with the foot off the gas and and cannot go more than 60mph.

Mackie Transmissions gave me a 3 year warranty or 100k miles whichever comes first so I’ll give them a call on Monday and see if they’ve got any slots coming up , I think it needs seeing to again
That doesn't sound healthy at all. If you have access to an OBD Code Reader it would be worth seeing what codes have been stored. If not, it's not a bad investment for £40-50 for a basic model. It made all the difference when I was trying to get my transmission sorted out by taking out a lot of the guess work and providing data for when the fault occurred (eg temperature, speeds etc). Fingers crossed you get the problem resolved.

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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by E46330 » Mon Jun 06, 2022 2:12 pm

DogWagen wrote:
Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:12 am
That doesn't sound healthy at all. If you have access to an OBD Code Reader it would be worth seeing what codes have been stored. If not, it's not a bad investment for £40-50 for a basic model. It made all the difference when I was trying to get my transmission sorted out by taking out a lot of the guess work and providing data for when the fault occurred (eg temperature, speeds etc). Fingers crossed you get the problem resolved.
So I’ve booked an appointment with Mackie Transmissions for Monday to have the car looked-over , my missus is 8 months pregnant and they can’t provide me with a courtesy car ! So I’ve said that if they need it for a number of days to let me know so I can arrange something else. With the warranty being so fresh I’m imagining it will be covered under this and hopefully put my gearbox woes behind me.


I’ve decided I’m going to get a new MAF sensor as well as I don’t think this part has been changed in a long time and should help with any throttle response issues while replacing the secondary air pump at the same time. 13321740985 is the part number for the MAF that I’ve found in the parts catalogue , would anyone know if that is the correct one for sure ? And I believe I’ve found the correct part for the pump but I’m unsure if this is definitely the correct one would anyone be able to help me with a part number for this please and finally is the fuel filter a standard 330i one also ?
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Re: E46 B3 Saloon 2002 Torque Converter and Steering Wheel Judder

Post by hashluck » Fri Jul 22, 2022 9:03 pm

Mackie rebuilt a second hand (Alpina spec) torque converter for me which was fitted by BMR Performance last week to my E46 B3S. So far so good over a few hundred miles. My original was working fine with perfect gear changes etc. just suffering from the P0741 (lack of) lock up issue (common across all E46 not just Alpina but a bugger on the Alpina due to the specific torque converter fitted but the good news is they can be rebuilt).

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