Rolling Road Day!! 8th September ***UPDATED WITH DETAILS***

A place to plan / discuss / debrief about ALPINA meets

Moderators: Charles, neil, D4

Dunk
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Post by Dunk » Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:09 am

neil wrote:The switchtronics are all quoted as rear wheel figures and I've put an approximate flywheel equivalent (based on 25% loss by transmission, which I think was what ALPINA said in the past).
What maths are you using Neil??

25% loss on a 202 wheel figure gives around 270 crank

202 / 3 x 4 = 270
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Post by neil » Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:15 am

I'm just going off the numbers that I was given as advisory by SRR.

Interesting as using your calculation gives some cars some very good results indeed.

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Post by Dunk » Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:33 am

The wheel figures are actuals, and 25% loss means that they're 75% of the crank figure...

Otherwise, every auto car, came in under power - which is an impossibility given the number of very well maintained cars that were there.

If mine had only put out 250, I'd have set fire to it and left it there :wink: :lol:
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Post by Geoff » Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:56 am

Thanks Dunk for organising a great day out. It was good to put faces to names and meet some new converts too.
Mine was slightly down on power but if I have understood the graphs correctly was up about 12lbs on torque - 259lbs/ft at 4725 rpm.
What are the other two graphs about?
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Post by Dunk » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:02 am

the other one should show fuelling vs power - the higher the fuelling graph, the leaner it is.

Ideally the fuelling graph will plunge at approx 4000rpm as it goes to Open Loop (Lambda readings disregarded) and onto enrichment as it simply throws in as much fuel as possible. It should lean off a bit right up top as you come off the top of power curve.

It should also be fairly level - lots of peaks/troughs/waves in the plot denotes fuelling problems, usually AMM related. (unless you have a V8, in which case they all do that Sir ;))
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Post by neil » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:15 am

Dunk wrote: If mine had only put out 250, I'd have set fire to it and left it there :wink: :lol:
:lol:

I'll recalculate them later and update the page - looks good news for tony and Brian (the figures SRR gave them we bang on - with the calc above they are both well up...

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Post by Dunk » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:30 am

Well I don't want everyone to apply my hopeless optimism to everything - but given Alpina's notoriety for exceeding quoted outputs and the sheer number of cars, only having one, possibly two, make fractionally more than it's quoted seems a bit odd.

Either that, or Charlie's rig is/was unreading - in which case yours is one very scary E36, and Nick will be even more chuffed than he is now!
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Post by D4 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:26 pm

Dunk
I'm not sure if i understand or agree with your calculations of adding 25%
my calc of yours is 202 = 252.5

using this method
202 / 4 x 5
or
202 x 1.25
or
202 / 100 x 125
or
202 + 25%

If you use 100 as an example
on your calc 100 / 3 x 4 = 133
this is a 33% uplift not a 25% one...
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Post by Dunk » Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:50 pm

Assume 200 is the wheels, with a parasitic loss of 25%, then that 200 is three quarters of the crank power.

Mine made 202, which I make as 269 - 202 / 75 x 100 = 269.

As an example, last time out, I made 220 wheels, corrected as 269 by Ray's dyno which assumes an 18% manual loss - 220 / 82 x 100. On a 25% loss that would have been 293.
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Post by D4 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:27 pm

i can see what you are saying and it makes sense.. just that we would then need to know how charlie worked out the manual figures.. because by adjusting the auto figures and not the manuals the obvious comparrision would be between Charles' B3s Touring and the Roadster S of Rich. where's Charles' car would appear tp be higher power than the Z4...
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Post by alpina46 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 2:57 pm

Great day & nice to meet some new people 8)

I shall give D4 my pics to post up later.

Still not convinced about how accurate the readings are on the auto's :?

But i'm sure it is possible that Charles B3s could put out more power than the Roadster S as the B3s is well & truly run in & has been very well maintained by North Oxford.

But the jurys still out for me.
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Post by johnsb10 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:19 pm

Thanks Dunk for organising the day. It was good to meet some people who don't ask "What's that" whenever I tell them it's not a BMW.

I was disappointed to make only 250 bhp, but hopefully that will improve once a new airflow meter is fitted. Thank God for a warranty.

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Post by alpina46 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:35 pm

Have you had your airflow meter checked John ?
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Post by johnsb10 » Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:34 pm

Not yet, it will be checked this week, at the same time as the gear lever failing to centre and headlight condensation problems are being attended to.

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Post by nealpina » Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:53 pm

As I said to Dunk, I was suffering from a hangover hence why I did not attend.

Will there be any stats/spreadsheets etc? It will be interesting to view.
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