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Ace Cafe London Alpina meet - June 23, 2018
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Norrie
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:00 am    Post subject: ACE Cafe Reply with quote

Charles, that is good news, in the sense that the endorsement is there. However, there is no actual Club is there? I mean as in a Limited Company which has no shareholders and is not for profit?

It does seem a pity, that we do not have more events as clearly they seem to appeal to owners. It was great to see people from the Midlands, Somerset, Hampshire and even Co Durham at the ACE meet.

Do you think there is any merit in exploring this on a more formal basis, I don't want to find issues, but for example the ACE cafe, did the person who organised it have public liability insurance? That is requested for some meets, without such club cannot display.

I have been a member of the BMWCCGB Club since 2011 and I am not sure the management of that club have any specific interest in ALPINA. In fact if it was not for Simon Alcorn there would be no ALPINA presence in that club.
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Charles
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:16 pm    Post subject: Re: ACE Cafe Reply with quote

Norrie wrote:
Charles, that is good news, in the sense that the endorsement is there. However, there is no actual Club is there? I mean as in a Limited Company which has no shareholders and is not for profit?

Does there actually need to be a formally constituted club with rules and regulations or is it possible to do things simply and informally? My experience of formal club structures is that it stifles involvement from people and leads to criticism of the way things are run. It also adds a level of bureaucracy into the process which is unnecessary. For example, a formally constituted legal entity has costs that need to be covered, which requires membership fees and all the administration associated with managing this process. Again, my experience of the way the BMWCCGB has been run in the past, with all of the infighting and accusations, is something I would definitely want to avoid. Remember, that ALPINA Gmbh and ALPINA UK are happy to endorse what we do in the way we do it, so why ditch what has worked for the vast majority for a long time for something that has shown itself, in the guise of the BMWCCGB, to cause more problems than it solves.

Quote:
It does seem a pity, that we do not have more events as clearly they seem to appeal to owners. It was great to see people from the Midlands, Somerset, Hampshire and even Co Durham at the ACE meet.

The way we have operated here for many years is to accommodate anything (within reason) that a member (or members) want to arrange. Since we operate on a loose structure of people with a shared interest, the success of such events depends on the uptake by people here. Some events are heavily attended, others fail to get off the ground and in the middle we have the relaxed and informal gatherings that we have seen recently that are well-received and appear to strike just the right balance. As such, if members want more events then they are free to start arranging them. However, to ensure maximum uptake, it makes sense to do so under the auspices of this group so that the event receives maximum coverage and air time.

Quote:
Do you think there is any merit in exploring this on a more formal basis, I don't want to find issues, but for example the ACE cafe, did the person who organised it have public liability insurance? That is requested for some meets, without such club cannot display.

For the reasons stated above, in a word, "No". It is perfectly possible to arrange an informal gathering of individuals such that public liability insurance is not necessary. However, if there is a call to arrange something at large events on a regular basis in the future, then looking at the structure would be a sensible option. Remember that the ALPINA community is tiny compared to the BMW one and so different structures will suit each group for different reasons - one size does not fit all!

Quote:
I have been a member of the BMWCCGB Club since 2011 and I am not sure the management of that club have any specific interest in ALPINA.

That's their loss, in my opinion. If they do not understand, appreciate and value by now what ALPINA contribute in terms of the development and evolution of the BMW brand, then I do not believe they will ever recognise ALPINA as a part of what they do.

Quote:
In fact if it was not for Simon Alcorn there would be no ALPINA presence in that club.

What Simon does is quietly recognised by many of us here and he regularly receives words of thanks and praise from those of us who understand his contributions. However, given my previous response, I don't envy Simon what he does as I can imagine it to be a thankless task at times.
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Norrie
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Joined: 31 Oct 2012
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Location: Horsham West Sussex

PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2018 5:45 pm    Post subject: ACE Cafe Reply with quote

Charles, thank you for your interesting and measured responses. There is much merit in what you say about bureaucratic and self appointed club management.

There I guess must be some compromise, Yatlin tried and succeeded in arranging an event. I guess he had not calculated that some might see the raffle element and view it with slight suspicion.

However, it was endorsed we can assume as Sytner offered the car and attended.

It will be interesting to see if they feel there is an merit in this support and if it will continue. I would be happy to try an arrange an event, however I am risk adverse and do not share your relaxed views over public liability.

Like many things if the risk is too onerous then I guess people will not attempt to arrange events.

In the past the BMWCCGB public liability insurance has been used to cover events made with or in association with the Club. For example at Silverstone Classic those people with ALPINA cars who have used the code to get a display parking space on the BMWCCGB stand under the ALPINA flag would be covered.

Events at Sytner are covered by their insurance, it would be interesting to know if ACE did?

However, change should not be for change sake, but for improvement of offering and those owner with disposal time or income may wish to be offered something?
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E65 B7 4.4 V8 supercharged No 106 (1 of 7 in UK) - purely for pleasure
E 39 523i for winter and track day - leave it anywhere
E92 325i - written off by X5 I was not driving!
E92 335D Twin Turbo - sold to Sytner Alpina
E 60 - 525D new - sold to Cooper BMW
E 60 - 530D new - sold at auction
E 39 - 520i new - sold at auction
E 30 - 316i new Touring - sold at auction
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Y4TND



Joined: 16 Oct 2017
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you all for your positive comments and constructive criticism which i always welcome Very Happy

Good to see some pictures from the event. If anyone else has more please E-mail them to me Smile

ACE Cafe have offered me a similar weekend next year. I hope WE can make it even better than this year!

Once i have confirmation from them and with your support i will re-book!

TIA

Cool
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PhillV8S
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Location: Worcestershire

PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any idea who had the drone taking footage of the meet?
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Y4TND



Joined: 16 Oct 2017
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Phil

I belive it was a lad called Dave. I will ask him to send it or upload it.
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