B12 5.7 ekat clocks question

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Drew
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B12 5.7 ekat clocks question

Post by Drew » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:26 pm

Hi All, had a question on my B12 for a while, but the post re the auciton consigned Alpinas reminds me.

My E38 B12 5.7 has normal BMW grey clocks/ dials, speedo goes to 155mph, so looks to be standard BMW fare. However the B12 going for auction has Alpina blue clocks, up to 300kmh

https://rmsothebys.com/en/auctions/es19 ... -57/733441

Does this imply someone has swapped out the Alpina clocks (if they stopped working, or similar) and put normal E38 clocks in instead of shelling out £££ for the B12 replacement version? Top speed of a B12 5.7 ekat is 175mph, so in theory... the car could go 20mph faster than the speedo

Or were the Alpina clocks an option?

the mileage on my B12 looks about right and is backed up by history, and the history makes no mention of clocks being replaced...

thanks
1998 B12 5.7 ekat
1972 3.0 CSL
2002 B10 V8S Touring (sold)
1981 635CSi (sold)

AG
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Post by AG » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:43 pm

clocks weren't an option as far as I know.
Former BMW CC 7 register chairman

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Post by Drew » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:57 pm

is there a VIN decoder I can use to get info on the interior trim spec? I've used this before, but it looks to not work any more:

http://www.bmwarchive.org/vin/bmw-vin-decoder.html

Plenty of decoders out there, but they don't seem to cover interior or other options. they're very happy to tell me I have a M73 engine, and other stuff I already know!!

ta
1998 B12 5.7 ekat
1972 3.0 CSL
2002 B10 V8S Touring (sold)
1981 635CSi (sold)

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Post by v8 ego » Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:13 pm

Alpina clocks weren't produced for MPH cars. Richard Croxford had a set specially made by Alpina for 066 but it cost a fortune IIRC.

With regards to a VIN decoder. I used to use bimmer.work (the replacement for your link) but it consistently comes back with "Oops, something went wrong!"

Try:

mdecoder.com

decoder.bvzine.com
Regards,

James

2012 BMW 520d ED (Gave it back)
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Post by Drew » Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:12 pm

thanks James, I'm just displaying my ignorance of all things Alpina then!!
:lol:

My B10 (E39 shape) had lovely blue Alpina clocks, but was 4 years younger than my B12. I guess this is something Alpina decided to fix between E38 and E39 based models

cheers
1998 B12 5.7 ekat
1972 3.0 CSL
2002 B10 V8S Touring (sold)
1981 635CSi (sold)

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Post by v8 ego » Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:07 pm

Hi Drew,

I think it was more down to volumes. Although they are similar, I would guess that the the E39 and E38 instrument clusters are similar but not identical.
Very few RHD B12s were produced for a mph market - this only being the UK. The only other RHD markets (Singapore, Japan etc.) were kph.
Regards,

James

2012 BMW 520d ED (Gave it back)
2011 BMW 535d GT SE
2008 BMW 730d SE (SOLD)
2007 BMW X5 3.0d SE (SOLD)
2007 D3 Touring 166 (SOLD)
2005 BMW 750i Sport (SOLD)
2005 BMW 730d Sport (SOLD)
2001 B10 V8 Touring 012/1 (SOLD)
2001 B10 V8 saloon 044/1 (SOLD)
1999 BMW 750iL (SOLD)
1997 BMW 750iL (SOLD)

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Post by simon13 » Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:13 pm

e36's were the same bog standard clocks
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Post by E24man » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:05 pm

As above, rhd E32/34/36/38 for the UK market didn't have blue faced dials, and even some early UK rhd E39's had black dials.

Anything that went to a km/h market, whether lhd or rhd, got blue clocks hence the silver rhd B12 5.7L from Japan that was auctioned last year and the rhd E31 B12 5.7's that were made for the Sultan of Brunei.

It was simply a mph thing...

I think the set of clocks that Richard Croxford had made up eventually ended up with the Estoril car that was his.
E24man

2001 Alpina B10 V8 Touring (1 of 12 rhd)
1997 Alpina B12 5.7 L (1 of 2 rhd)
1995 Alpina B10 4.6 Touring (1 of 1 rhd)
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Post by nealpina » Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:39 pm

E24man wrote:and even some early UK rhd E39's had black dials.
I’m not convinced of that. I think someone changed their clocks due to a fault and this became a myth
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Post by simon13 » Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:27 pm

All e46 cars however have the alpina treatment on the clocks however
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Post by E24man » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:07 pm

nealpina wrote:
E24man wrote:and even some early UK rhd E39's had black dials.
I’m not convinced of that. I think someone changed their clocks due to a fault and this became a myth
There must have been a very, very widespread problem then :lol:

Have a look through the Archive pictures of the early B10 V8 cars - the first I can see a picture of with blue dials is #240, assembled in October 1997; there were dozens of UK cars made before that, and loads of pictures of black and white dials on UK cars in the Archive prior to that.
E24man

2001 Alpina B10 V8 Touring (1 of 12 rhd)
1997 Alpina B12 5.7 L (1 of 2 rhd)
1995 Alpina B10 4.6 Touring (1 of 1 rhd)
1985 BMW M635CSi (1 of 524 rhd made, but less than half left now)
1982 BMW 635CSiA (1 of only hundreds left from the thousands made and still valiantly fighting a rusty grave)

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Post by E24man » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:13 pm

Richard was selling his at one stage...
Richard C wrote:I still have have the following items from my old car.

To suit only an E38 ALPINA B12 6.0 EKAT

This cluster was commissioned by me via the Alpina Factory and Siemens VDO and cost me 1,300 Euros and a trip to the factory.

It is the only one in the world that shows MPH and is in perfect working order.

The pixels all work perfectly, as you would expect, with only 13k miles worth of use.

All UK cars came with standard Black/white E38 clusters. The European cars have Blue and red Alpina ones with KPH

Image

I still have a spare set of 20" Alpina softline wheels too. They are the type without the tyre pessure sensors

If anybody is interested please send PM

Thanks
But like I said, I believe they ended up with the car.
E24man

2001 Alpina B10 V8 Touring (1 of 12 rhd)
1997 Alpina B12 5.7 L (1 of 2 rhd)
1995 Alpina B10 4.6 Touring (1 of 1 rhd)
1985 BMW M635CSi (1 of 524 rhd made, but less than half left now)
1982 BMW 635CSiA (1 of only hundreds left from the thousands made and still valiantly fighting a rusty grave)

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Post by nealpina » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:40 pm

E24man wrote:
nealpina wrote:
E24man wrote:and even some early UK rhd E39's had black dials.
I’m not convinced of that. I think someone changed their clocks due to a fault and this became a myth
There must have been a very, very widespread problem then :lol:

Have a look through the Archive pictures of the early B10 V8 cars - the first I can see a picture of with blue dials is #240, assembled in October 1997; there were dozens of UK cars made before that, and loads of pictures of black and white dials on UK cars in the Archive prior to that.
I said to myself check on there before posting but I was on my phone and just wanted to be lazy. Well it’s not a myth then :wink: I stand corrected and learnt something new today
Oscar Wilde & Burkard Bovensiepen: I have the simplest tastes. I am always satisfied with the best.

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Post by Drew » Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:16 am

good knowledge team!
:D

I'm not going to be spending 1300 Euros (=£1300 these days) on a set of blue clocks,
I wonder if a set could be manufactured from a set of E39 clocks however. So just replacing the dials and surround with the E39 B10 items, and then the speedo would need to be recalibrated (to go from a 155mph dial to 200mph).
I think speedo recalibration can be done through INPA
1998 B12 5.7 ekat
1972 3.0 CSL
2002 B10 V8S Touring (sold)
1981 635CSi (sold)

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Post by nealpina » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:19 pm

There may have been an element of the blue dials with Richard's reasoning of commissioning the clocks, but the main reason was so he knew the speed of the car when he was on the autobahn. As no doubt you're aware the car goes faster than the original MPH speedo readout of 155MPH
Oscar Wilde & Burkard Bovensiepen: I have the simplest tastes. I am always satisfied with the best.

ALPINA B3 3.2 Coupe Switch-Tronic ALPINA Blue
ALPINA B10 3.3 Saloon Manual Mora Metallic

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